Tonya and PQBON's WebLog
Having bought more new vehicles then almost any other 26 year old (at least any 26yo I know...) (my current count is: 7, '99 Tacoma, '00 Z3, '02 F650, '03 R1100S BXR, '02 Daytona 955i, '04 TTR-125LE) I have some experience with vehicle dealers. I'm also a friend of the owner of a small motorcycle dealer. I'm always very interested when I find articles online about either maximizing your vehicle purchase or horror stories from dealers about things customers have done to them.
I don't begrudge dealers making money. I also understand that people are buying, what for many, is the largest purchase they will ever make. Balancing this can be tough. People don't mind paying 100% markup on a $10 shirt or a $0.25 can of soda or even a $15 meal. A $30,000 purchase is entirely different. There are ways to manage your car purchasing experience. However, I have to say that I disagree with the idea that you should try to pay invoice on a car. Unless you are talking about a hold over model that is costing the dealer to keep around why should they make $0 on selling you a car? MSRP is MSRP for a reason. It builds in a reasonable profit for everyone involved. If you look at MSRP compared to dealer invoice that gap normally isn't that huge and it shouldn't be. Now, conversely in California, where we consume the largest percentage of cars in the US, dealers have started marking up cars with a dealer markup. To them I say MSRP is MSRP for a reason. I don't buy cars in my own neighbor hood because the dealers around me tend to markup. I flat won't pay a dealer markup, but I also don't mind paying MSRP. I pay MSRP on my food, my clothing, my computers, my motorcycle gear, so why not my vehicles?
When buying a car doing research is good. It allows you and the dealer to cut the bullshit. However, I lookup my new truck on cars.com. It seemed way off (the options valued at over $3000 only added $1,500 the the MSRP and the invoice. However, I ran it a second time and it seems to be more on the money. MSRP for my truck is about (I have a few accessories that weren't on the list) $31,550, and dealer invoice is $28,457. I paid MSRP. Now, this means that the dealer only made ~$3000 on my truck. Some would say that was a lot. Now, keep in mind, there were 3 people involved for 4 hours in selling this car. The sales manager, the sales guy, and the finance manager. In effect the dealer really isn't making that much money on the truck. Several dealerships I've talked to (I won't name names or anything like that because I never told them I would ever quote them in public) said that their sales department operates at either a slim profit or a loss. To stay in business they have to charge more for parts and service which is really how they support their dealership.
Take away from this what you will. I've never worked for a dealer, I don't own a dealer, and I never plan on it. I do buy a lot of vehicles and have had the occasion to talk to a lot of dealers. Just remember, get value for your dollar, but make sure you dealer will be there for you when you need him. My motorcycle dealer has gone above and beyond the call of duty for my several times. Because of this I am a loyal customer. I have had less good experiences at some car dealerships and will never go back to some. I have yet to find a car dealership that has ever treated me as well as my motorcycle dealer. In the extended entry body is info about my truck from cars. com and a list of dealers I like and don't like and why.
How I shop for a car: I almost always bring my significant other. I value her opinion and I like to see how she is treated by the sales people. I also tend to go with my parents. I value their opinions and I tend to be slightly less impulsive around them. I watch to see how they treat my father and my self and how they treat my mom and girlfriend. I will comment on all of these.
| Dealership | Location | Opinion |
| Folsom Lake Toyota | Folsom, Ca. | The service wasn't bad. The sales staff, like at many places tends to ignore women. I bought my first truck here. They weren't stealer and didn't go the extra mile to form a stong bond, but they made buying the truck a positive experiance. |
| Folsom Lake Ford | Folsom, Ca. | I have yet to actually buy from them, but they haven't been eliminated from my list. They do tend to ignore women, until you make it clear that the women's opinion is important. |
| Folsom Lake Nissan | Folsom, Ca. | I won't buy a car from them. They were pushy and agressive. I went there to look at cars when shopping around and after the test drive they wouldn't take a polite no for an answer. The jeep side was better (the dealer does multiple brands) but they still weren't happy with an answer of just shopping around. |
| Folsom Lake Dodge | Folsom, Ca. | The sales guy I had there was very nice. He accepted that I was just looking at trucks and wasn't ready to make a decision. He had no problem with the fact that I was shopping around. He answered all questions when on the test drive and when we said thank you, he gave us his card and went back inside. |
| Future Nissan | Roseville, Ca. | When I deferred to my girlfriend they start to take her more seriously but every new person who we dealt with had to go through that for them to engage with more then just me. I bought my truck here and would likely do it again. It seemed to take a very long time to do it compared to other purchases I have made. |
| Roseville BMW | Roseville, Ca. | My parents bought their M3 from them, I went with my father to buy the Z3 (that I later bought from my father) there and I tried to buy an MCoupe from them. The M3 and the Z3 went great. I was in the process of picking the options to order my M Coupe over the phone (I received the fax of available options and colors and was waiting for a call) that I never got. Apparently, during this time the sales guy I was working with left and the dealership changed hands. I might buy from them, or I might go to Alison BMW in Mountain View where I get my work done, or order directly through Dinan for a more custom BMW. The first two experiences were very very good. The second left my a little cold. In truth I could have called them back more then once for status. But to be honest when ordering a $40,000 car I don't expect to have to. |
| California BMW Triumph | Mountain View, Ca. | I have never had a bad experience with Cal BMW. I have a very personal relationship with most of the staff (when I walk in some times I feel like Norm or Cliff on Cheers). I have bought most of my motorcycles from them. (The only exception being the dirtbikes because they just don't sell dirtbikes.) I have brought Tonya along on some pre-buying/shopping expeditions and they have always been sure to include her in any discussion where they can. They have also been very good with merchandise and the like with either of us. |
| Redwood City Yamaha | Redwood City, Ca. | Tonya and I bought her TTR-125LE there. The experience was good. They seem a little lightly staffed (I have gone in there for parts for my YZ250F and also seen this). But all in all I can't complain. They were low pressure and didn't seem to ignore her. However, most of the questions went to me due to my experience in motorcycles. The experiance didn't seem quite as personal as the experience and Cal BMW but it was pretty good. |
| Peninsila Honda Ducati | Sunnyvale, Ca. | I live right across the street from them. I haven't been thrilled. They seem to be uninterested if your not really ready to buy that minute. They also don't allow test rides on sport bikes (they do at Cal BMW). I can't put my finger on where my unease comes from. I try to buy from them for things that Cal BMW doesn't have or do but it is hard and I can't quite put my finger on why. |
| MSRP | Invoice | |
| Base Price | $27,500 | $24,859 |
| Destination | $650 | $650 |
| Selected Options | $3,400 | $2,948 |
| Total Price | $31,550 | $28,457 |